Joe423In my opinion, Barcelona's system is one of the hardest to beat. They out number in midfield but keep genuine width with the wide strikers and the full backs.
I think to beat Barca, you have to play defensively. Every one of their players has to be occupied. I have looked around the site and agree with many that this system with a sweeper in a 3 man defense with a man sitting in front is the way to beat them.
Number 5 is assigned as Messi's man marker. I would have him to be physically imposing to knock Messi out of his stride(if it is possible).
Number 8 and 9, the wing backs have have brilliant fitness levels and the discipline to track the full backs, more so number 9 with Alvez, as Abidal is naturally more conservative.
7 and 10 have to press Busquest and Xavi intently, they make Barcelona tick and stopping Barcelona's passing at the source is sure to help disrupt their passing game.
Number 6 needs to stay as Iniesta's shadow. Not a man marker, but always within range to go and snuff him out. He can play the killer ball and if it's not on, dribble through and open space up himself. In my opinion he is Barca's second most important player, behind Messi and ahead of Xavi.
The 3 centre backs are fairly self explanatory, stay narrow and watch Villa and Pedro. The sweeper should move to get anything that the other two miss out on.
The striker, in this case number 11 I think should be a Javier Hernandez type striker, rather than a target man or false nine. Matching Barcelona man for man in midfield means that Pique could step up a lot more to add another body in, and in the rare breaks that the team will get, a fast striker one on one with Puyol will be a great way to nick a goal.
If the whole Barcelona team is on form and ready to dazzle, even beating their system might not matter. They have magic everywhere and can win a game in an instance. Even Mourinho's master class at the Nou Camp last season required a bit of luck, with Bojan's goal being harshly dissalowed.
I am definitely not the first to think of this formation, and I am only putting my own spin on it. Leave comments saying what you think and if you would do things differently. Thanks.
10.06.2011
OnceABluePedro and Villa would rip apart that 3 men defensive line you have there, and that's without any help from Messi, Xavi and Iniesta.
The only thing that would work is an extremely defensive 4-4-1-1. 3 of defensive midfielders marks M,X and I. The remaining defensive mid will be swiping in front of back 4 to tackle anything that spills from the markers.
The attack plan would be to release the forward behind Barca's back 4 through passes from the attacking mid. Set pieces will be of paramount importance in the attack.
This would probably get you a 1-0 win over Barca if you are lucky.
11.06.2011
mojojojo101I think a wide 3 at the back would work well. The two wider defenders mark Villa and Pedro tightly while the more central defender provides cover in the gaps. For me playing two centre backs is a waste as there is no obvious player for him to mark.
Then ahead of that you would use a very defensive midfielder, maybe even an adapted CB, who man marks Messi and tracks him across the pitch and into deep positions.
Ahead of that I'd keep it the same as Joe423.
Still using a man marking system is always risky as it takes just 1 second where someone isn't paying attention and you can be undone. In my opinion its a better idea to mark the space, Barca can't hurt you if you can put up 2 tight, compact and narrow banks of 4. Its then just a matter of annoying them and forcing them to make over ambitious passes where you can then hit them on the counter.
11.06.2011
OnceABlueUsing a 3 men defense is not every team's cup of tea. There's a reason there are so few teams employing it at the professional level. Pulling it of against Barca is another matter. I'd rather go back to basics.
Marking the space(or rather using the space) is Barca's forte. I'd rather not play their game. True, XMI will get rid of their markers every now and then, that's why I have the extra man for the cover.
11.06.2011
OnceABlueMy 4-4-1-1 on the field:
11.06.2011
Joe423The problem I see with your 4-4-1-1 is that Barca's full backs have the whole touchline to run down. If they get high enough the rb ad lb will have to come to confront them, giving Pedro and Villa a lot of space. If they move up and form a midfield 4 with Iniesta and Xavi, then the wider DM will have to come across and confront them leaving Iniesta and Xavi with time and space to pick a pass, and Messi with more room to drift into.
11.06.2011
Joe423The problem I see with your 4-4-1-1 is that Barca's full backs have the whole touchline to run down. If they get high enough the rb ad lb will have to come to confront them, giving Pedro and Villa a lot of space. If they move up and form a midfield 4 with Iniesta and Xavi, then the wider DM will have to come across and confront them leaving Iniesta and Xavi with time and space to pick a pass, and Messi with more room to drift into.
11.06.2011
OnceABlueIt's a calculated risk. The markers never leave their men, so it's upto the CB and RB to deal with Abidal and Alves.
12.06.2011
Demented GuyI would go with a 4-1-2-1-2 diamond with one of the carilleros moving wide to deal with the full backs and 2 extremely hard working front men.
12.06.2011
ars4nalThis looks a lot like a variation on catenaccio. If you sit back that much, I think Barca will eventually brake through
14.06.2011
nvrReal Madrid managed to extract a win and a draw out of 4 matches by sitting back. If you are agressive enough sitting back might work.
14.06.2011
SpaceGhostSitting back can work as long as they don't score first. If they do, then you can't sit back anymore, you've got to try and win the ball. If you field XI for the purpose of sitting back, transitioning into a press will probably be difficult.
So, I think its better to try and press them, similar to Arsenal's one win, but the shape described above is better for this particular opponent (although I don't agree with man marking - it's too inefficient).
14.06.2011
nvrArsenal won when Barca was experiencing their traditional mid season form dip. We were near to the peak of our form.
Manchester United tried to press early on, it didn't end well.
14.06.2011
ars4nalIt's not just about the formation here though, I think you'd have to half very quick wingers in a formation like this against Barcelona, to attack quickly on the counter attack and expoilt Barca's full backs
14.06.2011
mojojojo101
This is how I'd play, basically just pass 'normal' centre-back duties onto the two DM's and the DC is kept as a sweeper.
This would allow you to play a ridculously high line and keep Messi and Iniesta far away from goal.
14.06.2011
14.06.2011
SpaceGhostMan U had the wrong players on the pitch. That may have been the best option available that day, but a midfield of Giggs and Carrick had no chance. Since Vidic and Ferdinand were unwilling to leave their line it was 2 against 4 in midfield, and Rooney didn't do his job of neutralizing Busquets as the pivote.
14.06.2011
Joe423Great to see a lot of discussion here, currently the most popular topic on the site just now, I think.
On topic though, the way you have your defensive mid's set up, mojojojo, I think their natural inclination would be to move up and confront their direct opponents, in this case Xavi and Iniesta. While they could sit back and deep, that would leave just one centre mid to try and get around Xavi and Iniesta, and they could just play around him, unless the AM dropped back, which just leaves
Busquets free. If the DM's do push up, then messi has so much space to run at the CB or slip a ball through for Pedro and Villa.
The system I put out originally, I didn't want every player man marked, just for them to have a direct opponent who knows exactly who to close down at each area, as well as keep a free man at the back.
19.06.2011
Joe423Apart from Messi, who would basically have a man marker.
19.06.2011
